[fvc-wat-disc] fvc-wat-disc Digest, Vol 94, Issue 15
Eleanor Grant
eleanor7000 at gmail.com
Wed Jan 25 00:36:14 EST 2017
I just Googled tl;dr:
tl;dr <http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=tl%3Bdr&defid=359766>
Literally, "Too long; didn't read"
Said whenever a nerd makes a post that is too long to bother reading.
Bob's opinion of the survey results. I agree.
Eleanor
On 24 Jan 2017 23:11, <fvc-wat-disc-request at listserv.thinkers.org> wrote:
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> Today's Topics:
>
> 1. Results of the mydemocracy.ca survey are available (Bob Jonkman)
> 2. Re: Results of the mydemocracy.ca survey are available
> (Jennifer Ross)
> 3. Re: Results of the mydemocracy.ca survey are available
> (Anita Nickerson)
> 4. Re: Results of the mydemocracy.ca survey are available
> (Jennifer Ross)
> 5. Re: Results of the mydemocracy.ca survey are available
> (Anita Nickerson)
>
>
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: Bob Jonkman <bjonkman at sobac.com>
> To: Fair Vote Waterloo Region Discussion <
> fvc-wat-disc at listserv.thinkers.org>
> Cc:
> Date: Tue, 24 Jan 2017 20:52:09 -0500
> Subject: [fvc-wat-disc] Results of the mydemocracy.ca survey are available
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
>
> The results of the mydemocracy.ca survey have been published:
>
> https://www.canada.ca/en/campaign/electoral-reform/
> learn-about-canadian-federal-electoral-reform/
> mydemocracyca-online-digital-consultation-engagement-platform.html
>
> TL;DR: No electoral reform for us.
>
> - --Bob.
>
>
> - --
> Bob Jonkman <bjonkman at sobac.com> Phone: +1-519-635-9413
> SOBAC Microcomputer Services http://sobac.com/sobac/
> Software --- Office & Business Automation --- Consulting
> GnuPG Fngrprnt:04F7 742B 8F54 C40A E115 26C2 B912 89B0 D2CC E5EA
>
>
>
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
> Version: GnuPG v2
> Comment: Ensure confidentiality, authenticity, non-repudiability
>
> iEYEARECAAYFAliIBLsACgkQuRKJsNLM5epwlgCg97mSVzHpxa3jgF18mNFZFiRg
> 7WoAnRUlVTirY0BLduPKOdal7rX1Aq2q
> =AJW1
> -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
>
>
>
>
>
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: Jennifer Ross <2jennross at gmail.com>
> To: FVC Waterloo Region Discussion <fvc-wat-disc at listserv.thinkers.org>
> Cc:
> Date: Tue, 24 Jan 2017 21:13:59 -0500
> Subject: Re: [fvc-wat-disc] Results of the mydemocracy.ca survey are
> available
> I don't know what TL:DR means, but I did read the very clear and
> unequivocal call for coalition governments--three different questions, all
> three were in the 70% range for it. I did read where people don't really
> care how long it takes to count the ballots as long as they have choice on
> the ballots. I read a bunch of things that were slightly one way or the
> other, but for the most part, I thought it was remarkably in our favour!
>
> I frankly don't understand why people are crapping on it.
>
> Tomorrow will be a great discussion night!
>
> On Tue, Jan 24, 2017 at 8:52 PM, Bob Jonkman <bjonkman at sobac.com> wrote:
>
>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
>> Hash: SHA1
>>
>> The results of the mydemocracy.ca survey have been published:
>>
>> https://www.canada.ca/en/campaign/electoral-reform/learn-
>> about-canadian-federal-electoral-reform/mydemocracyca-
>> online-digital-consultation-engagement-platform.html
>>
>> TL;DR: No electoral reform for us.
>>
>> - --Bob.
>>
>>
>> - --
>> Bob Jonkman <bjonkman at sobac.com> Phone: +1-519-635-9413
>> SOBAC Microcomputer Services http://sobac.com/sobac/
>> Software --- Office & Business Automation --- Consulting
>> GnuPG Fngrprnt:04F7 742B 8F54 C40A E115 26C2 B912 89B0 D2CC E5EA
>>
>>
>>
>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
>> Version: GnuPG v2
>> Comment: Ensure confidentiality, authenticity, non-repudiability
>>
>> iEYEARECAAYFAliIBLsACgkQuRKJsNLM5epwlgCg97mSVzHpxa3jgF18mNFZFiRg
>> 7WoAnRUlVTirY0BLduPKOdal7rX1Aq2q
>> =AJW1
>> -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> This is the fvc-wat-disc mailing list
>> Post a message: fvc-wat-disc at listserv.thinkers.org
>> Unsubscribe: http://listserv.thinkers.org/mailman/listinfo/fvc-wat-disc_l
>> istserv.thinkers.org
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> No other Western democratic country concentrates as much political power in
> the hands of one person as Canada does with her Prime Minister.
>
>
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: Anita Nickerson <anitann88 at gmail.com>
> To: Jennifer Ross <jenn at jenniferross.ca>, FVC Waterloo Region Discussion <
> fvc-wat-disc at listserv.thinkers.org>
> Cc:
> Date: Tue, 24 Jan 2017 22:58:09 -0500
> Subject: Re: [fvc-wat-disc] Results of the mydemocracy.ca survey are
> available
> So far now Jenn and I are a fan club of two in a sea of people calling the
> results crap.
>
> I know the survey was bad - I wrote the guide to navigate the awful
> questions.
>
> But what's crap right now is the way the media is spinning it. It reminds
> me of the BC STV referendum - 58% said yes but STV was "rejected". Really?
>
> "Survey says Canadians love our system!" says the media!
>
> They weren't even ASKED about our system. If they were asked how many like
> FPTP I'm sure the usual 30-40% would say "great stuff".
>
> What Canadians love - according to mydemocracy.ca which probably 300,000
> people - is *MULTI-PARTY governments that have to make legislation
> together. *Seriously, that's what it says. About four questions all
> reinforcing that.
>
> People also said they want to express their preferences even if it takes
> longer for ballots to be counted and they want more diversity of views in
> Parliament.
>
> Even that awful question - "do you want a few big parties or many small
> parties" - what a stupid choice which reminds me of "do you want stability
> or a big zoo of wingdings" - 41% of people said they want "many small
> parties." I couldn't imagine more than 20% saying that. That 41% said "many
> small parties" is not a stat I'd make a poster of but I think it's
> significant.
>
> My own opinion is, the survey was designed with skewed questions probably
> so the gov't could say "no consensus" and "look, people don't want change".
> It came back loud and clear that people think we can do better than 39%
> majorities.
>
> Anita
>
> On Tue, Jan 24, 2017 at 9:13 PM, Jennifer Ross <2jennross at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> I don't know what TL:DR means, but I did read the very clear and
>> unequivocal call for coalition governments--three different questions, all
>> three were in the 70% range for it. I did read where people don't really
>> care how long it takes to count the ballots as long as they have choice on
>> the ballots. I read a bunch of things that were slightly one way or the
>> other, but for the most part, I thought it was remarkably in our favour!
>>
>> I frankly don't understand why people are crapping on it.
>>
>> Tomorrow will be a great discussion night!
>>
>> On Tue, Jan 24, 2017 at 8:52 PM, Bob Jonkman <bjonkman at sobac.com> wrote:
>>
>>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
>>> Hash: SHA1
>>>
>>> The results of the mydemocracy.ca survey have been published:
>>>
>>> https://www.canada.ca/en/campaign/electoral-reform/learn-abo
>>> ut-canadian-federal-electoral-reform/mydemocracyca-online-
>>> digital-consultation-engagement-platform.html
>>>
>>> TL;DR: No electoral reform for us.
>>>
>>> - --Bob.
>>>
>>>
>>> - --
>>> Bob Jonkman <bjonkman at sobac.com> Phone: +1-519-635-9413
>>> SOBAC Microcomputer Services http://sobac.com/sobac/
>>> Software --- Office & Business Automation --- Consulting
>>> GnuPG Fngrprnt:04F7 742B 8F54 C40A E115 26C2 B912 89B0 D2CC E5EA
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
>>> Version: GnuPG v2
>>> Comment: Ensure confidentiality, authenticity, non-repudiability
>>>
>>> iEYEARECAAYFAliIBLsACgkQuRKJsNLM5epwlgCg97mSVzHpxa3jgF18mNFZFiRg
>>> 7WoAnRUlVTirY0BLduPKOdal7rX1Aq2q
>>> =AJW1
>>> -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> This is the fvc-wat-disc mailing list
>>> Post a message: fvc-wat-disc at listserv.thinkers.org
>>> Unsubscribe: http://listserv.thinkers.org/m
>>> ailman/listinfo/fvc-wat-disc_listserv.thinkers.org
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> No other Western democratic country concentrates as much political power in
>> the hands of one person as Canada does with her Prime Minister.
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> This is the fvc-wat-disc mailing list
>> Post a message: fvc-wat-disc at listserv.thinkers.org
>> Unsubscribe: http://listserv.thinkers.org/mailman/listinfo/fvc-wat-disc_l
>> istserv.thinkers.org
>>
>>
>
>
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: Jennifer Ross <2jennross at gmail.com>
> To: Anita Nickerson <anitann88 at gmail.com>
> Cc: FVC Waterloo Region Discussion <fvc-wat-disc at listserv.thinkers.org>
> Date: Tue, 24 Jan 2017 23:00:56 -0500
> Subject: Re: [fvc-wat-disc] Results of the mydemocracy.ca survey are
> available
> And, there is a clear consensus on coalition governance!
>
> On Tue, Jan 24, 2017 at 10:58 PM, Anita Nickerson <anitann88 at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> So far now Jenn and I are a fan club of two in a sea of people calling
>> the results crap.
>>
>> I know the survey was bad - I wrote the guide to navigate the awful
>> questions.
>>
>> But what's crap right now is the way the media is spinning it. It reminds
>> me of the BC STV referendum - 58% said yes but STV was "rejected". Really?
>>
>> "Survey says Canadians love our system!" says the media!
>>
>> They weren't even ASKED about our system. If they were asked how many
>> like FPTP I'm sure the usual 30-40% would say "great stuff".
>>
>> What Canadians love - according to mydemocracy.ca which probably 300,000
>> people - is *MULTI-PARTY governments that have to make legislation
>> together. *Seriously, that's what it says. About four questions all
>> reinforcing that.
>>
>> People also said they want to express their preferences even if it takes
>> longer for ballots to be counted and they want more diversity of views in
>> Parliament.
>>
>> Even that awful question - "do you want a few big parties or many small
>> parties" - what a stupid choice which reminds me of "do you want stability
>> or a big zoo of wingdings" - 41% of people said they want "many small
>> parties." I couldn't imagine more than 20% saying that. That 41% said "many
>> small parties" is not a stat I'd make a poster of but I think it's
>> significant.
>>
>> My own opinion is, the survey was designed with skewed questions probably
>> so the gov't could say "no consensus" and "look, people don't want change".
>> It came back loud and clear that people think we can do better than 39%
>> majorities.
>>
>> Anita
>>
>> On Tue, Jan 24, 2017 at 9:13 PM, Jennifer Ross <2jennross at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> I don't know what TL:DR means, but I did read the very clear and
>>> unequivocal call for coalition governments--three different questions, all
>>> three were in the 70% range for it. I did read where people don't really
>>> care how long it takes to count the ballots as long as they have choice on
>>> the ballots. I read a bunch of things that were slightly one way or the
>>> other, but for the most part, I thought it was remarkably in our favour!
>>>
>>> I frankly don't understand why people are crapping on it.
>>>
>>> Tomorrow will be a great discussion night!
>>>
>>> On Tue, Jan 24, 2017 at 8:52 PM, Bob Jonkman <bjonkman at sobac.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
>>>> Hash: SHA1
>>>>
>>>> The results of the mydemocracy.ca survey have been published:
>>>>
>>>> https://www.canada.ca/en/campaign/electoral-reform/learn-abo
>>>> ut-canadian-federal-electoral-reform/mydemocracyca-online-di
>>>> gital-consultation-engagement-platform.html
>>>>
>>>> TL;DR: No electoral reform for us.
>>>>
>>>> - --Bob.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> - --
>>>> Bob Jonkman <bjonkman at sobac.com> Phone: +1-519-635-9413
>>>> SOBAC Microcomputer Services http://sobac.com/sobac/
>>>> Software --- Office & Business Automation --- Consulting
>>>> GnuPG Fngrprnt:04F7 742B 8F54 C40A E115 26C2 B912 89B0 D2CC E5EA
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
>>>> Version: GnuPG v2
>>>> Comment: Ensure confidentiality, authenticity, non-repudiability
>>>>
>>>> iEYEARECAAYFAliIBLsACgkQuRKJsNLM5epwlgCg97mSVzHpxa3jgF18mNFZFiRg
>>>> 7WoAnRUlVTirY0BLduPKOdal7rX1Aq2q
>>>> =AJW1
>>>> -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> This is the fvc-wat-disc mailing list
>>>> Post a message: fvc-wat-disc at listserv.thinkers.org
>>>> Unsubscribe: http://listserv.thinkers.org/m
>>>> ailman/listinfo/fvc-wat-disc_listserv.thinkers.org
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> No other Western democratic country concentrates as much political power in
>>> the hands of one person as Canada does with her Prime Minister.
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> This is the fvc-wat-disc mailing list
>>> Post a message: fvc-wat-disc at listserv.thinkers.org
>>> Unsubscribe: http://listserv.thinkers.org/m
>>> ailman/listinfo/fvc-wat-disc_listserv.thinkers.org
>>>
>>>
>>
>
>
> --
> No other Western democratic country concentrates as much political power in
> the hands of one person as Canada does with her Prime Minister.
>
>
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: Anita Nickerson <anitann88 at gmail.com>
> To: Jennifer Ross <jenn at jenniferross.ca>
> Cc: FVC Waterloo Region Discussion <fvc-wat-disc at listserv.thinkers.org>
> Date: Tue, 24 Jan 2017 23:10:46 -0500
> Subject: Re: [fvc-wat-disc] Results of the mydemocracy.ca survey are
> available
> I love that phrase - "clear consensus" 😋
>
> My other new favourite phrase is "realistic timeline".
>
> Those combat the two latest excuses we are hearing consistently from MPs.
>
> On Tue, Jan 24, 2017 at 11:00 PM, Jennifer Ross <2jennross at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> And, there is a clear consensus on coalition governance!
>>
>> On Tue, Jan 24, 2017 at 10:58 PM, Anita Nickerson <anitann88 at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> So far now Jenn and I are a fan club of two in a sea of people calling
>>> the results crap.
>>>
>>> I know the survey was bad - I wrote the guide to navigate the awful
>>> questions.
>>>
>>> But what's crap right now is the way the media is spinning it. It
>>> reminds me of the BC STV referendum - 58% said yes but STV was "rejected".
>>> Really?
>>>
>>> "Survey says Canadians love our system!" says the media!
>>>
>>> They weren't even ASKED about our system. If they were asked how many
>>> like FPTP I'm sure the usual 30-40% would say "great stuff".
>>>
>>> What Canadians love - according to mydemocracy.ca which probably
>>> 300,000 people - is *MULTI-PARTY governments that have to make
>>> legislation together. *Seriously, that's what it says. About four
>>> questions all reinforcing that.
>>>
>>> People also said they want to express their preferences even if it takes
>>> longer for ballots to be counted and they want more diversity of views in
>>> Parliament.
>>>
>>> Even that awful question - "do you want a few big parties or many small
>>> parties" - what a stupid choice which reminds me of "do you want stability
>>> or a big zoo of wingdings" - 41% of people said they want "many small
>>> parties." I couldn't imagine more than 20% saying that. That 41% said "many
>>> small parties" is not a stat I'd make a poster of but I think it's
>>> significant.
>>>
>>> My own opinion is, the survey was designed with skewed questions
>>> probably so the gov't could say "no consensus" and "look, people don't want
>>> change". It came back loud and clear that people think we can do better
>>> than 39% majorities.
>>>
>>> Anita
>>>
>>> On Tue, Jan 24, 2017 at 9:13 PM, Jennifer Ross <2jennross at gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> I don't know what TL:DR means, but I did read the very clear and
>>>> unequivocal call for coalition governments--three different questions, all
>>>> three were in the 70% range for it. I did read where people don't really
>>>> care how long it takes to count the ballots as long as they have choice on
>>>> the ballots. I read a bunch of things that were slightly one way or the
>>>> other, but for the most part, I thought it was remarkably in our favour!
>>>>
>>>> I frankly don't understand why people are crapping on it.
>>>>
>>>> Tomorrow will be a great discussion night!
>>>>
>>>> On Tue, Jan 24, 2017 at 8:52 PM, Bob Jonkman <bjonkman at sobac.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
>>>>> Hash: SHA1
>>>>>
>>>>> The results of the mydemocracy.ca survey have been published:
>>>>>
>>>>> https://www.canada.ca/en/campaign/electoral-reform/learn-abo
>>>>> ut-canadian-federal-electoral-reform/mydemocracyca-online-di
>>>>> gital-consultation-engagement-platform.html
>>>>>
>>>>> TL;DR: No electoral reform for us.
>>>>>
>>>>> - --Bob.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> - --
>>>>> Bob Jonkman <bjonkman at sobac.com> Phone: +1-519-635-9413
>>>>> SOBAC Microcomputer Services http://sobac.com/sobac/
>>>>> Software --- Office & Business Automation --- Consulting
>>>>> GnuPG Fngrprnt:04F7 742B 8F54 C40A E115 26C2 B912 89B0 D2CC E5EA
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
>>>>> Version: GnuPG v2
>>>>> Comment: Ensure confidentiality, authenticity, non-repudiability
>>>>>
>>>>> iEYEARECAAYFAliIBLsACgkQuRKJsNLM5epwlgCg97mSVzHpxa3jgF18mNFZFiRg
>>>>> 7WoAnRUlVTirY0BLduPKOdal7rX1Aq2q
>>>>> =AJW1
>>>>> -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> This is the fvc-wat-disc mailing list
>>>>> Post a message: fvc-wat-disc at listserv.thinkers.org
>>>>> Unsubscribe: http://listserv.thinkers.org/m
>>>>> ailman/listinfo/fvc-wat-disc_listserv.thinkers.org
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> No other Western democratic country concentrates as much political
>>>> power in the hands of one person as Canada does with her Prime
>>>> Minister.
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> This is the fvc-wat-disc mailing list
>>>> Post a message: fvc-wat-disc at listserv.thinkers.org
>>>> Unsubscribe: http://listserv.thinkers.org/m
>>>> ailman/listinfo/fvc-wat-disc_listserv.thinkers.org
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> No other Western democratic country concentrates as much political power in
>> the hands of one person as Canada does with her Prime Minister.
>>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> This is the fvc-wat-disc mailing list
> Post a message: fvc-wat-disc at listserv.thinkers.org
> Unsubscribe: http://listserv.thinkers.org/mailman/listinfo/fvc-wat-disc_
> listserv.thinkers.org
>
>
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