<html><head></head><body bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000" lang="en-US" style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); line-height: initial;">                                                                                      <div style="width: 100%; font-size: initial; font-family: Calibri, 'Slate Pro', sans-serif, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); text-align: initial; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">‎Thanks Laurel </div><div style="width: 100%; font-size: initial; font-family: Calibri, 'Slate Pro', sans-serif, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); text-align: initial; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">Good to learn more about your background, beliefs‎ and motivation. </div><div style="width: 100%; font-size: initial; font-family: Calibri, 'Slate Pro', sans-serif, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); text-align: initial; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">I'm with you all the way, except for your absolute rejection of "strategic voting"‎.   </div><div style="width: 100%; font-size: initial; font-family: Calibri, 'Slate Pro', sans-serif, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); text-align: initial; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">Please me know how any other voting strategy would have ended the barbaric FPTP. </div><div style="width: 100%; font-size: initial; font-family: Calibri, 'Slate Pro', sans-serif, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); text-align: initial; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);"><br></div><div style="width: 100%; font-size: initial; font-family: Calibri, 'Slate Pro', sans-serif, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); text-align: initial; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">Also. I owe you a public apology for wrongly accusing you regarding my email going to the listserv, when in fact it was mistake that I unknowingly made when I sent it! Humble apologies. </div><div style="width: 100%; font-size: initial; font-family: Calibri, 'Slate Pro', sans-serif, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); text-align: initial; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);"><br></div><div style="width: 100%; font-size: initial; font-family: Calibri, 'Slate Pro', sans-serif, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); text-align: initial; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">Sincerely. </div><div style="width: 100%; font-size: initial; font-family: Calibri, 'Slate Pro', sans-serif, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); text-align: initial; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">Stu. </div>                                                                                                                                     <div style="width: 100%; font-size: initial; font-family: Calibri, 'Slate Pro', sans-serif, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); text-align: initial; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);"><br></div>                                                                                                                                                                                                   <div style="font-size: initial; font-family: Calibri, 'Slate Pro', sans-serif, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); text-align: initial; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">Sent from my BlackBerry 10 smartphone on the Rogers network.</div>                                                                                                                                                                                  <table width="100%" style="background-color:white;border-spacing:0px;"> <tbody><tr><td colspan="2" style="font-size: initial; text-align: initial; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">                           <div style="border-style: solid none none; border-top-color: rgb(181, 196, 223); border-top-width: 1pt; padding: 3pt 0in 0in; font-family: Tahoma, 'BB Alpha Sans', 'Slate Pro'; font-size: 10pt;">  <div><b>From: </b>Laurel L. Russwurm</div><div><b>Sent: </b>Saturday, March 18, 2017 8:09 PM</div><div><b>To: </b>FVC Waterloo Region Discussion</div><div><b>Reply To: </b>FVC Waterloo Region Discussion</div><div><b>Subject: </b>Re: [fvc-wat-disc] Liberals on PR ~ Bardish Chagger & Raj Saini</div></div></td></tr></tbody></table><div style="border-style: solid none none; border-top-color: rgb(186, 188, 209); border-top-width: 1pt; font-size: initial; text-align: initial; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);"></div><br><div id="_originalContent" style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">
  
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    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">Dear Stu:<br>
      <br>
      Just thought you ought to know I do not speak for FVC... but
      because I take photos &tc and use the internet, I've been
      given the keys to the online platforms, but I am very careful not
      to express my ideas as Fair Votes.  In fact, although our
      objectives are similar, not only am I not now, nor ever have been
      (and likely never will be) a member, I don't always agree with FVC
      official or unofficial policy, nor do I always agree with all Fair
      Voters.<br>
      <br>
      Nor have I ever been a Liberal, back in the days when I was still
      a happily unaligned voter, I joined as a supporter to vote against
      Mr. Trudeau as leader because even then the only policy he
      articulated at that point was strong AV support, and later
      actually paid them $10 to support a Liberal PR supporter in the
      candidacy race for my riding (she didn't win).  Whether aligned or
      not, I very much oppose strategic voting, because I believe it has
      helped prop up our feudal FPTP for decades. <br>
      <br>
      I also wanted to point out all the electoral reform media I
      produce is either dedicated to the public domain or released with
      a Creative Commons license so anyone who wishes to can use it or
      rework it for their own purposes.<br>
      <br>
      I do agree diversity is good, that's why I support PR:  I think
      every voice deserves representation, even those i disagree with.<br>
      <br>
      Regards,<br>
      Laurel<br>
      <br>
      <br>
      On 03/18/2017 01:35 PM, STUART CHANDLER wrote:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote cite="mid:20170318173515.6107221.17985.13307@gmail.com" type="cite">
      <div style="width: 100%; font-size: initial; font-family: Calibri,
        'Slate Pro', sans-serif, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);
        text-align: initial; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">Thanks
        Laurel.</div>
      <div style="width: 100%; font-size: initial; font-family: Calibri,
        'Slate Pro', sans-serif, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);
        text-align: initial; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">Thanks
        for your considered opinion. </div>
      <div style="width: 100%; font-size: initial; font-family: Calibri,
        'Slate Pro', sans-serif, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);
        text-align: initial; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">Unfortunately,
        it seems we are arguing apples and oranges. </div>
      <div style="width: 100%; font-size: initial; font-family: Calibri,
        'Slate Pro', sans-serif, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);
        text-align: initial; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">I
        apologize if I was not clear enough in stating that my approach
        was purely from an individual perspective - definitely not an
        organizational one. ( I would never speak "on behalf of FVC". I
        rely on folks like you and Bob to do that.)</div>
      <div style="width: 100%; font-size: initial; font-family: Calibri,
        'Slate Pro', sans-serif, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);
        text-align: initial; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">However,
        those of us who may support and appreciate the work of FVC‎ are
        individuals as well, and capable of a diversity of thought and
        action. (You know, much like we might hope from for those who
        count themselves among the Liberal fold!) </div>
      <div style="width: 100%; font-size: initial; font-family: Calibri,
        'Slate Pro', sans-serif, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);
        text-align: initial; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">As
        JT loves to say, "We succeed, not in spite of our diversity, but
        because of it.". And we either believe that, or we don't. (At
        this point, it seems JT is not believing his own rhetoric when
        it comes to ER. What a shame! Literally.)</div>
      <div style="width: 100%; font-size: initial; font-family: Calibri,
        'Slate Pro', sans-serif, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);
        text-align: initial; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">So,
        it seems that your response to my suggestion ‎came from an
        organizational perspective (eg: "....making threats that we will
        prevent anyone from being re-elected."), but also from a
        personal perspective.  Naturally, you are interested in
        influencing how others in our midst think (as you mailed your
        response to the FV Thinkers Listserve, even though I had
        deliberately sent my email to only you, Bob, and Sharon, and had
        explained why I did so).   </div>
      <div style="width: 100%; font-size: initial; font-family: Calibri,
        'Slate Pro', sans-serif, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);
        text-align: initial; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);"><br>
      </div>
      <div style="width: 100%; font-size: initial; font-family: Calibri,
        'Slate Pro', sans-serif, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);
        text-align: initial; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);"><span style="font-size: initial; text-align: initial; line-height:
          initial;">Unfortunately, I've been quite busy, and lack the
          time to expand further now, except to emphasize the point that
          if FVC‎, plus all the individuals connected with it, even
          tangentially,  took only one approach to this matter we would
          lose the advantage of the strength that any group of people
          has by virtue of its diversity.   Much like the sage financial
          advice: "it's important to diversify". </span></div>
      <div style="width: 100%; font-size: initial; font-family: Calibri,
        'Slate Pro', sans-serif, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);
        text-align: initial; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);"><br>
      </div>
      <div style="width: 100%; font-size: initial; font-family: Calibri,
        'Slate Pro', sans-serif, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);
        text-align: initial; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">I
        have o‎ther concerns with your advice, but will need to explain
        them at another time. </div>
      <div style="width: 100%; font-size: initial; font-family: Calibri,
        'Slate Pro', sans-serif, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);
        text-align: initial; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);"><br>
      </div>
      <div style="width: 100%; font-size: initial; font-family: Calibri,
        'Slate Pro', sans-serif, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);
        text-align: initial; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">With
        continued respect. </div>
      <div style="width: 100%; font-size: initial; font-family: Calibri,
        'Slate Pro', sans-serif, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);
        text-align: initial; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);"><br>
      </div>
      <div style="width: 100%; font-size: initial; font-family: Calibri,
        'Slate Pro', sans-serif, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);
        text-align: initial; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">Stu
        Chandler</div>
      <div style="width: 100%; font-size: initial; font-family: Calibri,
        'Slate Pro', sans-serif, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);
        text-align: initial; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);"> </div>
      <div style="font-size: initial; font-family: Calibri, 'Slate Pro',
        sans-serif, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); text-align:
        initial; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">Sent from my BlackBerry 10 smartphone on the Rogers network.</div>
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              initial; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">
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                border-top-color: rgb(181, 196, 223); border-top-width:
                1pt; padding: 3pt 0in 0in; font-family: Tahoma, 'BB
                Alpha Sans', 'Slate Pro'; font-size: 10pt;">
                <div><b>From: </b>Laurel L. Russwurm</div>
                <div><b>Sent: </b>Thursday, March 16, 2017 5:34 PM</div>
                <div><b>To: </b>FVC Waterloo Region Discussion</div>
                <div><b>Reply To: </b>FVC Waterloo Region Discussion</div>
                <div><b>Subject: </b>Re: [fvc-wat-disc] Liberals on PR
                  ~ Bardish Chagger & Raj Saini</div>
              </div>
            </td>
          </tr>
        </tbody>
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        <div class="moz-cite-prefix">Dear Stuart:<br>
          <br>
          I'm glad you like the videos, and the reason I've produced
          them is to make it easier to hold our elected MPs to account. 
          <br>
          <br>
          That said, I am uncomfortable with the idea of making threats
          that we will prevent anyone from being re-elected.  Among
          other things, that is one reason those who achieve power via
          FPTP want to keep it... when our votes don't count it is
          really tough to do.  That's what happened in 2015 and we are
          clearly no better off.  [Say next time we elect the NDP... and
          then they don't do PR... then after that, it will be the
          Conservatives turn again?  This dance must stop.  Public
          opinion is our friend, and it is building.  Trudeau pulled the
          plug because it is growing.]<br>
          <br>
          In my experience it is always better to enlist support than
          have a negative confrontation and make an enemy.  I have an
          idea Bardish is aware of the videos, and would no doubt prefer
          them to go away.  They are already public and getting watched
          and shared.  By all means, when you call oor write or tweet to
          her, mention you've just seen one of them and been reminded
          how ardently she supported  the pivotal PR promise in the
          election. Tell her how disappointed you are that she's let you
          down.  <br>
          <br>
          The way to apply positive pressure is to make them count by
          helping them spread.  Share them and other PR videos and keep
          sharing them.  If every one who wants PR shared 5 pro-PR
          things with their social network every day, we will keep the
          momentum building.  <br>
          <br>
          I understand people worry that if they share too much
          political stuff they will alienate their family and friends,
          but unless that is all you ever post, that is not likely. 
          Among other things, both Facebook and Twitter social networks
          limit how much of what we post gets shared to our friend's
          timelines, so even if you share 5 things, most of them won't
          be seen by most of your friends and family.<br>
          <br>
          Keeping this alive and growing can change Liberal Policy. 
          Better they figure this out now while there is still time to
          have PR for 2019.  <br>
          <br>
          There is a lot more out there besides Fair Vote stuff --> <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://www.fairvotewrc.ca/resources/">http://www.fairvotewrc.ca/resources/</a><br>
          <br>
          I've been writing articles [ <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="https://whoacanada.wordpress.com/">https://whoacanada.wordpress.com/
          </a>] and making graphics  [ <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="https://www.flickr.com/photos/laurelrusswurm/albums/">https://www.flickr.com/photos/laurelrusswurm/albums/</a>]
          as well as videos [<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="https://www.youtube.com/user/LaurelRusswurm/videos">https://www.youtube.com/user/LaurelRusswurm/videos</a>]
          for well over a year, but there is<b> a lot more</b> out
          there... search Google or YouTube or Facebook or Twitter or
          Flickr or Tumblr anywhere you go online for "Proportional
          Representation" or "Electoral Reform"<br>
          <br>
          There is a great new February 11th video from Toronto here: <br>
          <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n9FoyOIi3q0">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n9FoyOIi3q0<br>
          </a><br>
          Share, and share some more.  Educate people who don't know,
          encourage everyone you know to keep calling & visiting
          Bardish and all the rest.  <br>
          <br>
          The Dutch election came out well because they have PR.   Their
          Trump earned only the support he deserved (and none of the
          other parties will ever make a coalition with him)<br>
          <br>
          There is also a growing push for PR in the UK (thanks to UKIP)
          and USA (Trump) ... it isn't just here, it's everywhere, and
          that helps us too.  We are on the right track.<br>
          <br>
          Regards,<br>
          Laurel<br>
          <br>
          <br>
          <br>
          On 03/16/2017 08:14 AM, STUART CHANDLER wrote:<br>
        </div>
        <blockquote cite="mid:20170316121412.6107221.79501.13163@gmail.com" type="cite">
          <div style="width: 100%; font-size: initial; font-family:
            Calibri, 'Slate Pro', sans-serif, sans-serif; color: rgb(31,
            73, 125); text-align: initial; background-color: rgb(255,
            255, 255);">Thanks so much, Laurel. </div>
          <div style="width: 100%; font-size: initial; font-family:
            Calibri, 'Slate Pro', sans-serif, sans-serif; color: rgb(31,
            73, 125); text-align: initial; background-color: rgb(255,
            255, 255);">These videos are dy-no-mite!</div>
          <div style="width: 100%; font-size: initial; font-family:
            Calibri, 'Slate Pro', sans-serif, sans-serif; color: rgb(31,
            73, 125); text-align: initial; background-color: rgb(255,
            255, 255);">To see Chagger repeat, over, and over again her
            commitment to ER, and making every vote equal, and
            effective. And promise legislation within 18 months.</div>
          <div style="width: 100%; font-size: initial; font-family:
            Calibri, 'Slate Pro', sans-serif, sans-serif; color: rgb(31,
            73, 125); text-align: initial; background-color: rgb(255,
            255, 255);"> </div>
          <div style="width: 100%; font-size: initial; font-family:
            Calibri, 'Slate Pro', sans-serif, sans-serif; color: rgb(31,
            73, 125); text-align: initial; background-color: rgb(255,
            255, 255);">I'm thinking that, particularly considering the
            importance of her position, there may be something to be
            gained if some of her constituents put her on notice that
            they possess the videos, and will use them extensively in
            2019 to unseat her. If she was led to believe the threat was
            serious enough (eg: "We have formed a group, and are
            building a fund to pay for the anti-Chagger, anti-liar
            campaign. We promise that 2015 will be the last time you get
            elected!"), AND THAT HER ONLY WAY OUT<span style="font-size:
              initial; line-height: initial; text-align: initial;"></span><span style="font-size: initial; text-align: initial;
              line-height: initial;"> would be to get ER back on the
              Liberal agenda (along with an apology stating that there
              was more support for ER than they thought), it might be
              enough to motivate her. It can be added that we (it'd be
              good to come up with a catchy name for the group, partly
              so it is not conflated with Fair Vote) are working on
              supporting similar groups in other ridings. (in fact, it
              would be good to indicate that this idea came from another
              group in another Liberal-held riding)</span></div>
          <div style="width: 100%; font-size: initial; font-family:
            Calibri, 'Slate Pro', sans-serif, sans-serif; color: rgb(31,
            73, 125); text-align: initial; background-color: rgb(255,
            255, 255);">Without such serious pressure tactics, I don't
            think there's a chance Cheers. </div>
          <div style="width: 100%; font-size: initial; font-family:
            Calibri, 'Slate Pro', sans-serif, sans-serif; color: rgb(31,
            73, 125); text-align: initial; background-color: rgb(255,
            255, 255);">Stu. </div>
          <div style="width: 100%; font-size: initial; font-family:
            Calibri, 'Slate Pro', sans-serif, sans-serif; color: rgb(31,
            73, 125); text-align: initial; background-color: rgb(255,
            255, 255);">‎PS: I'm just sending this to 3 of you to make
            sure of no leaks. </div>
          <div style="width: 100%; font-size: initial; font-family:
            Calibri, 'Slate Pro', sans-serif, sans-serif; color: rgb(31,
            73, 125); text-align: initial; background-color: rgb(255,
            255, 255);"><br>
          </div>
          <div style="font-size: initial; font-family: Calibri, 'Slate
            Pro', sans-serif, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);
            text-align: initial; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">Sent from my BlackBerry 10 smartphone on the Rogers network.</div>
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                    font-family: Tahoma, 'BB Alpha Sans', 'Slate Pro';
                    font-size: 10pt;">
                    <div><b>From: </b>Laurel L. Russwurm</div>
                    <div><b>Sent: </b>Wednesday, March 15, 2017 2:03 AM</div>
                    <div><b>To: </b><a moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:fvc-wat-disc@listserv.thinkers.org">fvc-wat-disc@listserv.thinkers.org</a></div>
                    <div><b>Reply To: </b>FVC Waterloo Region
                      Discussion</div>
                    <div><b>Subject: </b>Re: [fvc-wat-disc] Liberals on
                      PR ~ Bardish Chagger & Raj Saini</div>
                  </div>
                </td>
              </tr>
            </tbody>
          </table>
          <br>
          <div id="_originalContent" style="background-color: rgb(255,
            255, 255);">
            <meta content="text/html; charset=UTF-8" http-equiv="Content-Type">
            <div class="moz-cite-prefix">Videos can only go viral if
              people share them.  <br>
              <br>
              Bardish has not done what she personally promised re PR,
              not even close.  Raj either.  And we have video on both
              you can watch before talking to your MP.<br>
              <br>
              I've just posted another soundbite from the 2015 All
              Candidates Meeting (1 minute video)<br>
              <br>
              <meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html;
                charset=UTF-8">
              <span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Roboto,
                arial, sans-serif; font-size: 20px; font-style: normal;
                font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-caps:
                normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal;
                orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;
                text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2;
                word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
                background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); display: inline
                !important; float: none;">PR4Canada: Bardish Chagger ~
                Representation</span><br>
              <a moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=piEsxsekJ6I">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=piEsxsekJ6I</a><br>
              <br>
              <span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Roboto,
                arial, sans-serif; font-size: 20px; font-style: normal;
                font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-caps:
                normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal;
                orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;
                text-transform: none; white-space: nowrap; widows: 2;
                word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
                background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); display: inline
                !important; float: none;"><span class="Apple-converted-space">Bardish Chagger: 4
                  Questions</span></span><br>
              <a moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=abUOn9pi5Lc">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=abUOn9pi5Lc</a><br>
              <br>
              and<br>
              <br>
              <span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Roboto,
                arial, sans-serif; font-size: 20px; font-style: normal;
                font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-caps:
                normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal;
                orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;
                text-transform: none; white-space: nowrap; widows: 2;
                word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
                background-color: rgb(246, 246, 246); display: inline
                !important; float: none;">Bardish Chagger: an Electoral
                System based on the Principle of Fairness</span> (just
              under 5 minutes)
              <meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html;
                charset=UTF-8">
              <br>
              <a moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sE6lyNJrl6U&t=5s">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sE6lyNJrl6U&t=5s</a>
              There's also <br>
              <br>
              <meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html;
                charset=UTF-8">
              <meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html;
                charset=UTF-8">
              <span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Roboto,
                arial, sans-serif; font-size: 20px; font-style: normal;
                font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-caps:
                normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal;
                orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;
                text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2;
                word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
                background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); display: inline
                !important; float: none;">Raj Saini on Proportional
                Representation</span><br>
              <a moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jlAUTMXRPnc&t=449s">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jlAUTMXRPnc&t=449s</a><br>
              <br>
              The video from the three FVC All Candidates meetings all
              the candidates expressed support for PR, all were on the
              same side.  (Probably part of why there were no such
              events in Cambridge or Kit-SH><br>
              <br>
              Bardish talks about how interested people were at the
              door, how crowded in the event. <br>
              Bardish and Raj both talk about the consultation, how it
              should be done.  They did not do it that way.  <br>
              <br>
              Every LPC MP in WR was asked to make sure the ERRE
              Committee came here.  It did not.<br>
              <br>
              Monsef did, and all 4 LPC MPs used that as their
              consultation.  It should have been as well as, not instead
              of.  <br>
              <br>
              There was little or no advertising done for Monsef, all
              the dates were last minute, so people couldn't plan.  <br>
              <br>
              The LPC did NOT do a good job of consulting.  Every LPC MP
              needed to host at LEAST one (better more) consultation
              events.  <br>
              <br>
              Blaming the failure of the consultation on Canadians is
              bushwah.  <br>
              <br>
              Share the videos.  They can still have PR in place in time
              if they move fast.  If not, it is important that people
              are informed before the next election, and we really want
              them to remember this, so share the videos :)<br>
              <br>
              Regards,<br>
              Laurel<br>
              <br>
              <br>
              <br>
              <br>
              On 03/12/2017 10:21 PM, Donald Fraser wrote:<br>
            </div>
            <blockquote cite="mid:CAGQVxk2J=u6TMTZUnGStP2iOB-3yQ2knof=zE-wztXbu2uHgMQ@mail.gmail.com" type="cite">
              <div dir="ltr">well done, Martha</div>
              <div class="gmail_extra"><br>
                <div class="gmail_quote">On 12 March 2017 at 22:15,
                  STUART CHANDLER <span dir="ltr"><<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:stuchandler43@gmail.com" target="_blank">stuchandler43@gmail.com</a>></span>
                  wrote:<br>
                  <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
                    .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">Thanks
                    Martha. <br>
                    Great to hear your points & experience with
                    Bardish. <br>
                    ‎I can appreciate that you'd be frustrated with
                    someone claiming commitment to electoral reform, yet
                    not pursuing it " for the greater good" of all
                    Canadians. I'm certain that anyone so committed
                    would in fact be convinced that the greater good of
                    all would be served by proceding with ER.<br>
                    As it was she who called you, she'd make sur she had
                    all her rhetoric in order before picking up the
                    phone. Hard to deal with that level of preperation. <br>
                    Nice work. And thanks again. <br>
                    Best regards. <br>
                    Stu.<br>
                    <br>
                    Sent from my BlackBerry 10 <wbr>smartphone on the Rogers
                    network.<br>
                      Original Message  <br>
                    From: Martha Lauzon<br>
                    Sent: Sunday, March 12, 2017 4:39 PM<br>
                    To: <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:fvc-wat-disc@listserv.thinkers.org">fvc-wat-disc@listserv.<wbr>thinkers.org</a><br>
                    Reply To: FVC Waterloo Region Discussion<br>
                    Subject: [fvc-wat-disc] Phone convo with Bardish
                    Chagger<br>
                    <div class="HOEnZb">
                      <div class="h5"><br>
                        Hi all,<br>
                        <br>
                        I don't write in much here, just tend to lurk
                        (and take action where appropriate--e.g.,
                        pestering Bardish)<br>
                        <br>
                        Bardish Chagger just called me to chat about
                        electoral reform. A lot of what she was saying
                        was basically talking points, i.e., we need to
                        govern for all Canadians, not just people like
                        you & me who are knowledgeable. Well, yes,
                        but if you see a problem with a lack of
                        knowledge, perhaps the government should launch
                        an education campaign? She claims that's what
                        the new bill C33 does, which I was skeptical
                        about, but since I haven't read the bill, I
                        wasn't able to speak to the point. I did mention
                        the new Local PR initiative taking off in
                        Guelph, whose name escaped me on the phone, but
                        which turns up with a quick Google search. She
                        said she would look into it, and just in case
                        she gets stuck, I'm about to send her a link.
                        Because I'm helpful like that.<br>
                        <br>
                        I'm concerned because she says that many
                        constituents approached her after the town
                        halls, saying that they had felt that FVC folks
                        were very dismissive of opinions that run
                        counter to ours, and that instead of being
                        brought in to the conversation, they felt driven
                        away. Assuming that she's not making this up,
                        perhaps this is something we could work on, to
                        be more welcoming and information-dispensing,
                        and a little less judgy. Many of us have been
                        working on this for years and years, and it can
                        be easy to get impatient with people who are
                        just hearing about PR for the first time,
                        especially if they don't see the light right out
                        of the gate.<br>
                        <br>
                        She also claimed that the Liberals had conducted
                        a poll, and while most people they talked to
                        advocated reform, once they asked people what
                        system they preferred, FPTP came out the winner.
                        I asked her if this survey and its results were
                        public, because I'd LOVE to see the actual
                        questions that were asked, but she dodged that
                        one.<br>
                        <br>
                        She also had the nerve to champion the <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://mydemocracy.ca" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">mydemocracy.ca</a> survey. I
                        may be reading more into her explanation than
                        she intended, but what I heard was that they
                        deliberately didn't ask any questions related to
                        electoral reform because people aren't educated.
                        I tried to explain to her that that was BS
                        because they could have constructed questions
                        that addressed PR without using any of the PR
                        jargon, but she stuck to her guns that what they
                        really cared about was people's values (and
                        "hard working people everywhere").<br>
                        <br>
                        So, all in all, a little frustrating. She
                        insisted several times that she herself was
                        committed to electoral reform but now that
                        they're governing for all Canadians they need to
                        set personal preferences aside in favour of the
                        greater good yada yada yada. I *am* impressed,
                        because this is the first time in my 40-odd
                        years that my MP has chosen to call me to
                        address issues that I've contacted them about.
                        Usually, I'm doing well with a polite written
                        PFO.<br>
                        <br>
                        Y'all may be receiving your own phone calls
                        soon.<br>
                        <br>
                        Cheers,‎<br>
                        Martha<br>
                        <br>
                        <br>
                        ______________________________<wbr>__________<br>
                        From: fvc-wat-disc [<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:fvc-wat-disc-bounces@listserv.thinkers.org">fvc-wat-disc-bounces@<wbr>listserv.thinkers.org</a>]
                        on behalf of <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:fvc-wat-disc-request@listserv.thinkers.org">fvc-wat-disc-request@listserv.<wbr>thinkers.org</a>
                        [<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:fvc-wat-disc-request@listserv.thinkers.org">fvc-wat-disc-request@<wbr>listserv.thinkers.org</a>]<br>
                        Sent: March 12, 2017 12:00 PM<br>
                        To: <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:fvc-wat-disc@listserv.thinkers.org">fvc-wat-disc@listserv.<wbr>thinkers.org<br>
                        </a><br>
                        Subject: fvc-wat-disc Digest, Vol 96, Issue 11<br>
                        <br>
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                        <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:fvc-wat-disc-owner@listserv.thinkers.org">fvc-wat-disc-owner@listserv.<wbr>thinkers.org</a><br>
                        <br>
                        When replying, please edit your Subject line so
                        it is more specific<br>
                        than "Re: Contents of fvc-wat-disc digest..."<br>
                        <br>
                        <br>
                        Today's Topics:<br>
                        <br>
                        1. Re: been monitoring Chagger-Tweet (STUART
                        CHANDLER)<br>
                        2. Re: Chagger tweets (fvc-wat-disc Digest, Vol
                        96, Issue 10)<br>
                        (Eleanor Grant)<br>
                        <br>
                        <br>
                        ------------------------------<wbr>------------------------------<wbr>----------<br>
                        <br>
                        Message: 1<br>
                        Date: Sat, 11 Mar 2017 19:02:06 -0500<br>
                        From: STUART CHANDLER <<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:stuchandler43@gmail.com">stuchandler43@gmail.com</a>><br>
                        To: Donald Fraser <<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:fvc-wat-disc@listserv.thinkers.org">fvc-wat-disc@listserv.<wbr>thinkers.org</a>>,
                        FVC Waterloo<br>
                        Region Discussion <<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:fvc-wat-disc@listserv.thinkers.org">fvc-wat-disc@listserv.<wbr>thinkers.org</a>><br>
                        Subject: Re: [fvc-wat-disc] been monitoring
                        Chagger-Tweet<br>
                        Message-ID: <<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:20170312000206.6107221.43418.12964@gmail.com">20170312000206.6107221.43418.<wbr>12964@gmail.com</a>><br>
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                        <br>
                        ------------------------------<br>
                        <br>
                        Message: 2<br>
                        Date: Sat, 11 Mar 2017 21:31:55 -0500<br>
                        From: Eleanor Grant <<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:eleanor7000@gmail.com">eleanor7000@gmail.com</a>><br>
                        To: <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:fvc-wat-disc@listserv.thinkers.org">fvc-wat-disc@listserv.<wbr>thinkers.org</a><br>
                        Subject: Re: [fvc-wat-disc] Chagger tweets
                        (fvc-wat-disc Digest, Vol<br>
                        96, Issue 10)<br>
                        Message-ID:<br>
                        <CAEYE8EB4=<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:WJ0Ac_Xn3zsryTdGLzJu67SesEy_d7quwwt8z0V8w@mail.gmail.com">WJ0Ac_<wbr>Xn3zsryTdGLzJu67SesEy_<wbr>d7quwwt8z0V8w@mail.gmail.com</a>><br>
                        Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"<br>
                        <br>
                        Donald, what's your Twitter handle?<br>
                        Follow me @eleanor70001 .<br>
                        <br>
                        <br>
                        On 11 Mar 2017 18:13, <<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:fvc-wat-disc-request@listserv.thinkers.org">fvc-wat-disc-request@<wbr>listserv.thinkers.org</a>>
                        wrote:<br>
                        <br>
                        > Send fvc-wat-disc mailing list submissions
                        to<br>
                        > <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:fvc-wat-disc@listserv.thinkers.org">fvc-wat-disc@listserv.<wbr>thinkers.org</a><br>
                        ><br>
                        > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World
                        Wide Web, visit<br>
                        > <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://listserv.thinkers.org/mailman/listinfo/fvc-wat-disc_" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://listserv.thinkers.org/<wbr>mailman/listinfo/fvc-wat-disc_</a><br>
                        > <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://listserv.thinkers.org" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">listserv.thinkers.org</a><br>
                        ><br>
                        > or, via email, send a message with subject
                        or body 'help' to<br>
                        > <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:fvc-wat-disc-request@listserv.thinkers.org">fvc-wat-disc-request@listserv.<wbr>thinkers.org</a><br>
                        ><br>
                        > You can reach the person managing t<br>
                        he list at<br>
                        > <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:fvc-wat-disc-owner@listserv.thinkers.org">fvc-wat-disc-owner@listserv.<wbr>thinkers.org</a><br>
                        ><br>
                        > When replying, please edit your Subject
                        line so it is more specific<br>
                        > than "Re: Contents of fvc-wat-disc
                        digest..."<br>
                        ><br>
                        > Today's Topics:<br>
                        ><br>
                        > 1. been monitoring Chagger-Tweet (Donald
                        Fraser)<br>
                        > 2. Re: been monitoring Chagger-Tweet
                        (Donald Fraser)<br>
                        > 3. Re: been monitoring Chagger-Tweet (Jon
                        Bathmaker)<br>
                        ><br>
                        ><br>
                        > ---------- Forwarded message ----------<br>
                        > From: Donald Fraser <<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:donaldafraser@gmail.com">donaldafraser@gmail.com</a>><br>
                        > To: FVC Waterloo Region Discussion <<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:fvc-wat-disc@listserv.thinkers.org">fvc-wat-disc@listserv.<wbr>thinkers.org</a>><br>
                        > Cc:<br>
                        > Bcc:<br>
                        > Date: Sat, 11 Mar 2017 17:45:35 -0500<br>
                        > Subject: [fvc-wat-disc] been monitoring
                        Chagger-Tweet<br>
                        > not much substance ... mostly meet &
                        greets ... social events ... so far<br>
                        > nothing about which I could tell her "it
                        would go better with PR". (I have<br>
                        > a lot better luck with Trump-Tweet ... lots
                        of ammunition there!)<br>
                        ><br>
                        > cheers,<br>
                        > Don<br>
                        ><br>
                        ><br>
                        > ---------- Forwarded message ----------<br>
                        > From: Donald Fraser <<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:donaldafraser@gmail.com">donaldafraser@gmail.com</a>><br>
                        > To: FVC Waterloo Region Discussion <<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:fvc-wat-disc@listserv.thinkers.org">fvc-wat-disc@listserv.<wbr>thinkers.org</a>><br>
                        > Cc:<br>
                        > Bcc:<br>
                        > Date: Sat, 11 Mar 2017 17:58:48 -0500<br>
                        > Subject: Re: [fvc-wat-disc] been monitoring
                        Chagger-Tweet<br>
                        > NO sooner did I speak when she gave me an
                        opportunity!<br>
                        ><br>
                        > On 11 March 2017 at 17:45, Donald Fraser
                        <<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:donaldafraser@gmail.com">donaldafraser@gmail.com</a>>
                        wrote:<br>
                        ><br>
                        >> not much substance ... mostly meet
                        & greets ... social events ... so far<br>
                        >> nothing about which I could tell her
                        "it would go better with PR". (I have<br>
                        >> a lot better luck with Trump-Tweet ...
                        lots of ammunition there!)<br>
                        >><br>
                        >> cheers,<br>
                        >> Don<br>
                        >><br>
                        ><br>
                        ><br>
                        ><br>
                        > ---------- Forwarded message ----------<br>
                        > From: Jon Bathmaker <<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:jon.bathmaker@gmail.com">jon.bathmaker@gmail.com</a>><br>
                        > To: <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:fvc-wat-disc@listserv.thinkers.org">fvc-wat-disc@listserv.<wbr>thinkers.org</a><br>
                        > Cc:<br>
                        > Bcc:<br>
                        > Date: Sat, 11 Mar 2017 18:13:02 -0500<br>
                        > Subject: Re: [fvc-wat-disc] been monitoring
                        Chagger-Tweet<br>
                        ><br>
                        > Good work Don!<br>
                        ><br>
                        > Best,<br>
                        > Jon<br>
                        > On 3/11/2017 5:58 PM, Donald Fraser wrote:<br>
                        ><br>
                        > NO sooner did I speak when she gave me an
                        opportunity!<br>
                        ><br>
                        > On 11 March 2017 at 17:45, Donald Fraser
                        <<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:donaldafraser@gmail.com">donaldafraser@gmail.com</a>>
                        wrote:<br>
                        ><br>
                        >> not much substance ... mostly meet
                        & greets ... social events ... so far<br>
                        >> nothing about which I could tell her
                        "it would go better with PR". (I have<br>
                        >> a lot better luck with Trump-Tweet ...
                        lots of ammunition there!)<br>
                        >><br>
                        >> cheers,<br>
                        >> Don<br>
                        >><br>
                        ><br>
                        ><br>
                        ><br>
                        > ______________________________<wbr>_________________<br>
                        > This is the fvc-wat-disc mailing list<br>
                        > Post a message: <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:fvc-wat-disc@listserv.thinkers.org">fvc-wat-disc@listserv.<wbr>thinkers.org</a><br>
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                        ><br>
                        ><br>
                        ><br>
                        > ______________________________<wbr>_________________<br>
                        > This is the fvc-wat-disc mailing list<br>
                        > Post a message: <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:fvc-wat-disc@listserv.thinkers.org">fvc-wat-disc@listserv.<wbr>thinkers.org</a><br>
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                        ><br>
                        ><br>
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                        <br>
                        ------------------------------<br>
                        <br>
                        Subject: Digest Footer<br>
                        <br>
                        ______________________________<wbr>_________________<br>
                        This is the fvc-wat-disc mailing list<br>
                        Post a message: <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:fvc-wat-disc@listserv.thinkers.org">fvc-wat-disc@listserv.<wbr>thinkers.org</a><br>
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                        <br>
                        <br>
                        ------------------------------<br>
                        <br>
                        End of fvc-wat-disc Digest, Vol 96, Issue 11<br>
                        ******************************<wbr>**************<br>
                        <br>
                        <br>
                        <br>
                        ______________________________<wbr>_________________<br>
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                        This is the fvc-wat-disc mailing list<br>
                        Post a message: <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:fvc-wat-disc@listserv.thinkers.org">fvc-wat-disc@listserv.<wbr>thinkers.org</a><br>
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                      </div>
                    </div>
                  </blockquote>
                </div>
                <br>
              </div>
              <br>
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              <br>
              <pre wrap="">_______________________________________________
This is the fvc-wat-disc mailing list
Post a message: <a moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:fvc-wat-disc@listserv.thinkers.org">fvc-wat-disc@listserv.thinkers.org</a>
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</pre>
            </blockquote>
            <br>
            <p><br>
            </p>
            <div class="moz-signature">-- <br>
              <hr>♦  <strong><a moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://laurel.russwurm.org/blogs/">Laurel L.
                  Russwurm, Author</a></strong>  ♦  <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://libreleft.com"><strong>Libreleft
                  Books</strong></a>  ♦  <strong><a moz-do-not-send="true" href="https://laurelrusswurm.wordpress.com/">Laurel L.
                  Russwurm's Free Culture Blog</a></strong>  ♦  <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL66aOelRZ1qtZ49PbicKRQC-OgAXPUhNz"><strong>Libreleft
                  Pictures</strong></a>  ♦  <strong><a moz-do-not-send="true" href="https://whoacanada.wordpress.com/">Whoa!Canada</a></strong> 
              ♦  <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://laurelrusswurm.tumblr.com/"><strong>visual
                  laurel</strong></a>   ♦  <strong><a moz-do-not-send="true" href="https://www.flickr.com/photos/laurelrusswurm/albums/">on
                  Flickr</a></strong>  ♦ </div>
            <br>
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          <br>
          <br>
          <br>
          <br>
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          <br>
          <pre wrap="">_______________________________________________
This is the fvc-wat-disc mailing list
Post a message: <a moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:fvc-wat-disc@listserv.thinkers.org">fvc-wat-disc@listserv.thinkers.org</a>
Unsubscribe: <a moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://listserv.thinkers.org/mailman/listinfo/fvc-wat-disc_listserv.thinkers.org">http://listserv.thinkers.org/mailman/listinfo/fvc-wat-disc_listserv.thinkers.org</a>
</pre>
        </blockquote>
        <br>
        <p><br>
        </p>
        <div class="moz-signature">-- <br>
          <hr>♦  <strong><a moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://laurel.russwurm.org/blogs/">Laurel L.
              Russwurm, Author</a></strong>  ♦  <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://libreleft.com"><strong>Libreleft
              Books</strong></a>  ♦  <strong><a moz-do-not-send="true" href="https://laurelrusswurm.wordpress.com/">Laurel L.
              Russwurm's Free Culture Blog</a></strong>  ♦  <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL66aOelRZ1qtZ49PbicKRQC-OgAXPUhNz"><strong>Libreleft
              Pictures</strong></a>  ♦  <strong><a moz-do-not-send="true" href="https://whoacanada.wordpress.com/">Whoa!Canada</a></strong> 
          ♦  <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://laurelrusswurm.tumblr.com/"><strong>visual
              laurel</strong></a>   ♦  <strong><a moz-do-not-send="true" href="https://www.flickr.com/photos/laurelrusswurm/albums/">on Flickr</a></strong> 
          ♦ </div>
        <br>
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      <br>
      <br>
      <br>
      <br>
      <fieldset class="mimeAttachmentHeader"></fieldset>
      <br>
      <pre wrap="">_______________________________________________
This is the fvc-wat-disc mailing list
Post a message: <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:fvc-wat-disc@listserv.thinkers.org">fvc-wat-disc@listserv.thinkers.org</a>
Unsubscribe: <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://listserv.thinkers.org/mailman/listinfo/fvc-wat-disc_listserv.thinkers.org">http://listserv.thinkers.org/mailman/listinfo/fvc-wat-disc_listserv.thinkers.org</a>
</pre>
    </blockquote>
    <br>
    <p><br>
    </p>
    <div class="moz-signature">-- <br>
      <hr>♦  <strong><a href="http://laurel.russwurm.org/blogs/">Laurel
          L. Russwurm, Author</a></strong>  ♦  <a href="http://libreleft.com"><strong>Libreleft Books</strong></a> 
      ♦  <strong><a href="https://laurelrusswurm.wordpress.com/">Laurel
          L. Russwurm's Free Culture Blog</a></strong>  ♦  <a href="https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL66aOelRZ1qtZ49PbicKRQC-OgAXPUhNz"><strong>Libreleft
          Pictures</strong></a>  ♦  <strong><a href="https://whoacanada.wordpress.com/">Whoa!Canada</a></strong> 
      ♦  <a href="http://laurelrusswurm.tumblr.com/"><strong>visual
          laurel</strong></a>   ♦  <strong><a href="https://www.flickr.com/photos/laurelrusswurm/albums/">on
          Flickr</a></strong>  ♦
    </div>
  

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