[fvc-wat-disc] "STV"

Sun Oct 14 22:41:33 EDT 2018

Keep harping on it whenever you see it, Corliss.  Honestly, we have to be
the worst group in the history of insider language ever.  I think I see a
start to the end of PR this and that every time you turn around.  Now it is
Pro Rep all over the place, which is at least a bit better.  But I do fear
we will never see the end of MMP, STV, DMP (I don't really know either) and
AV, FPTP and any other electoral system you'd care to name with a bunch of
initials.
Bookkeeping Services
519-501-2736
No other Western democratic country concentrates as much political power in
the hands of one person as Canada does with her Prime Minister.

On Sun, Oct 14, 2018 at 10:37 PM Corliss Olson <cpolson11 at gmail.com> wrote:

> Good. I don't feel stupid. Neither Doug nor I have heard of that one.
> I was worried it was contagious.
>
> Seriously, I think at least once in an email words should be used --
> unless the list is only for the initiated.
> Corliss
>
> On Sun, Oct 14, 2018, 9:57 PM Sharon Sommerville <
> sharonsommerville at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Not idiotic.... STV is Single Transferable Vote.... you can see why it
>> goes by STV! :)
>>
>>
>>
>> On Sun, Oct 14, 2018 at 9:48 PM Corliss Olson <cpolson11 at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi Sharon,
>>>
>>> I don't generally think of myself as terribly thick, but the acronyms on
>>> this list drive me nuts. I have to wrack my brain when I read all the
>>> initials, so if that's me, I venture others may have similar struggles.
>>> Maybe not the folks on the list, but anyone beyond for sure.
>>>
>>> That said, what the heck is STV? I just called out to Doug, too, & he
>>> said, "I have no idea." I know as soon as you tell me, I'll say, "Of
>>> course, now I feel like an idiot," but there you are. Idiot it is.
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>> Corliss
>>>
>>> On Sun, Oct 14, 2018 at 9:15 PM Sharon Sommerville <
>>> sharonsommerville at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hi Jonathan,
>>>>
>>>> You are being most open minded toward Karen.  My thinking is based on a
>>>> specific conversation about RB she & I had a couple of years ago in which
>>>> she clearly stated her support for RB.  I pointed out that in an election
>>>> for 4 seats in a single jurisdiction such the election for regional
>>>> councillors here in Waterloo Region, RB would become STV.  At the
>>>> time, she said she would be okay with that.  As a long time Liberal
>>>> politician, she might well support ranked ballots.
>>>>
>>>> We often expect experienced politicians to know about electoral systems
>>>> and many don't.  Karen may not even have known what I was referring to when
>>>> I said RB would become STV, but as an experienced politician she went
>>>> with the flow.  In this most current situation on Reddit, she
>>>> homogenized the issue and then did a pivot.   A classic political move to
>>>> not be pinned down by any definitive position.
>>>>
>>>> On another occasion she asked me why do we need electoral reform?  Her
>>>> point being that FPTP is fine.  It is a bit hard to say what Karen
>>>> thinks about electoral reform but we can be fairly certain that it isn't
>>>> very high on her list of priorities.  In fact she stated during this
>>>> campaign that she doesn't have any priorities and will be guided by what
>>>> the electorate wants...  uh huh.... right... listen I have some land here,
>>>> looks a bit like a swamp at the moment but it is for sale and the LRT is
>>>> going to be going right by here....
>>>>
>>>> Cheers,
>>>> S.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Sun, Oct 14, 2018 at 4:51 PM Jonathan Cassels <cassels.jon at gmail.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> To be fair to Karen, I only asked about Ranked Ballots. For all I
>>>>> know, she was coy about ranked ballots because she actually favours STV
>>>>> locally, but didn't want to say so without knowing the opinions of the
>>>>> questioner.
>>>>>
>>>>> I agree that Rob Deutschmann is the regional chair candidate who's
>>>>> been most vocal in supporting election reform, though. When Yes, Cambridge!
>>>>> posted a pledge on twitter yesterday (asking all Cambridge candidates to
>>>>> sign on to support ranked ballots municipally), he commented:
>>>>>
>>>>> I voted yes for ranked ballots. If elected I pledge that I will do
>>>>> what I can as Regional Chair to support the upper and lower tier municipal
>>>>> efforts to introduce ranked ballots for the 2022 municipal elections.
>>>>>
>>>>> As far as I know, no one specifically solicited Rob for that comment.
>>>>> He was paying attention to the local effort to bring in ranked ballots
>>>>> himself (even though he's running at a different level) and pledged his
>>>>> support to bring in ranked ballots at that level.
>>>>>
>>>>> On Sun, 14 Oct 2018 at 15:00, Sharon Sommerville <
>>>>> sharonsommerville at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Also disappointing that she is talking about mandatory voting,
>>>>>> something nobody is considering. She is creating a distraction & red
>>>>>> herring issue.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Not great for us if she is elected.  Rob Deutschmann would be a
>>>>>> better choice for us.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Sun, Oct 14, 2018 at 1:51 PM Jennifer Ross <2jennross at gmail.com>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Well, that's not good.  In the past, we have discussed with Karen
>>>>>>> the Regional issue that it would be STV and she's been very happy to
>>>>>>> support that.  Nothing said here about the proportional aspects of ranked
>>>>>>> ballots in the Regional context.  Disappointing.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Jenn
>>>>>>> Bookkeeping Services
>>>>>>> 519-501-2736
>>>>>>> No other Western democratic country concentrates as much political
>>>>>>> power in the hands of one person as Canada does with her Prime
>>>>>>> Minister.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Sun, Oct 14, 2018 at 1:17 PM Jonathan Cassels <
>>>>>>> cassels.jon at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Karen Redman did an AMA on Reddit today, and I asked her about
>>>>>>>> ranked ballots in Cambridge and whether she'd be open to adopting it at the
>>>>>>>> regional level. I thought you all might like to see her answer:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> There is a real appeal for the ranked ballot system and knowing
>>>>>>>> that whoever represents us at the Regional level will have received 50% or
>>>>>>>> more of the vote.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Voter turnout is alarmingly low normally citing between 30-40% for
>>>>>>>> Municipal Elections. Local elections matter because the decisions made at
>>>>>>>> Regional Council impact you, your family and business almost immediately.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I am in favour of finding a way to get more voters engaged in local
>>>>>>>> elections. Maybe ranked ballots could be considered as part of a larger
>>>>>>>> electoral reform package similar to Australia's where there is mandatory
>>>>>>>> voting? Anyone who does not vote is fined through the tax system.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I look forward to seeing the results of the referendum in Cambridge
>>>>>>>> and continuing the conversation.
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