[fvc-wat-disc] Letters to the Editor Needed

Fri Feb 3 18:51:14 EST 2017

Because their main issue is not PR. They're a long term organization who
have many issues.

Before the election I tried very hard to get them to incorporate a
candidate's position on PR into their decision whether to endorse or not.

They chose to endorse the only Liberal candidate in Canada who outright
told us he's support PR never. And others who didn't support PR.

I understand the only goal then was to get rid of Harper.

But I cannot see Leadnow organizing 3 years ahead of an election to have
people sign a pledge saying they'll only vote NDP or Green. Even those on
the Vote Better segment of their list.

What if it looks like O'Leary's going to come up the middle? You think we
won't be "voting together" even reluctantly again in some way? You think
they want to burn their bridges now with the governing MPs (and alienate
their Liberal supporters) by basically saying they're an NDP/Green front
based on one issue, when there are SO many other issues they need to be
able to influence the Liberal government on over the next three years.

I don't see any org running this kind of campaign 3 years ahead of an
election. I think it would have to be grassroots.

But ask your contacts in Leadnow - you're not the only one with that idea.

Anita

On Fri, Feb 3, 2017 at 5:49 PM, Jon Bathmaker <jon.bathmaker at gmail.com>
wrote:

> Why do you think that Leadnow will not support having people sign the I
> won't vote etc. pledge?
>
> Jon
> On 2/3/2017 5:31 PM, Anita Nickerson wrote:
>
> What would be most effective is two things:
>
> a) having as many people sign an "I will not vote for you again because
> you broke your electoral reform promise" pledge as signed the vote together
> pledge
>
> b) media at his office embarrassing him with that as I outlined below, so
> more and more people find out about it
>
> These kinds of partisan activities probably cannot be done by FVC is the
> problem, Leadnow is not going to do it, and without the mailing lists to do
> it, it is difficult. But not impossible.
>
> Anita
>
> On Fri, Feb 3, 2017 at 4:54 PM, Jon Bathmaker <jon.bathmaker at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> > I know this is not positive but the Liberals need to own this.
>> The only world that is positive all the time is the one inhabited by Mary
>> Poppins.   Since I don't live in that world I'm fine with it.
>>
>> I remember Raj coming to a little gathering in a pub for the Leadnow
>> types who had helped him get elected.  He was late but he had clearly made
>> a largish effort to get there and was very grateful for the Leadnow crew's
>> efforts on his behalf.   That lasted about a week.
>>
>> I think we should stop playing nice with these turds.  I think we should
>> just visit Bardish and Bryan and Marwan and Raj and deal the cards straight
>> off the top of the deck.  OK Mr/Ms. MP, you don't want to play with us
>> anymore after we got you elected to implement PR?  No problem, we're not
>> going to get mad, we're going get even by organizing like crazy and handing
>> you your ass in 19 (Kiss the pension goodbye!)  Now go and tell *that* to
>> Prime Minister Pretty Boy.
>>
>> Regards,
>> Jon
>> On 2/3/2017 4:24 PM, Anita Nickerson wrote:
>>
>> I would like to let you know that my Liberal tuque has arrived.
>>
>> I am interested in a march to Raj Saini's office carrying a coffin
>> symbolizing the Death of Liberal Promise on Electoral Reform.
>>
>> It would have to be at a time when he is there so he can come out and
>> explain why the Prime Minister now says that the promise he and every one
>> of his MPs used to get elected is "wrong" and several other lies.
>>
>> The best thing would be if some media were there, or we can send them
>> pictures and quotes afterward.
>>
>> I know this is not positive but the Liberals need to own this.
>>
>> Every MP needs to own this and to know that nobody buys their lame
>> excuses.
>>
>> Every MP especially needs to know that their crass calculations on this
>> one were wrong, and the very people who helped elect them may now help
>> un-elect them.
>>
>> I would also like to deliver Raj the tuke. I wouldn't want his ears to
>> get cold.
>>
>> Of course saner voices are welcome to propose more constructive action.
>>
>> Anita
>>
>> On Fri, Feb 3, 2017 at 12:59 PM, Donald Fraser <donaldafraser at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> thanks, Cathe
>>>
>>> On 3 February 2017 at 12:47, <cdcampbell9 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Great letter, Don. It was clear and readable.
>>>>
>>>> Sent from my BlackBerry 10 smartphone.
>>>> *From: *Donald Fraser
>>>> *Sent: *Friday, February 3, 2017 12:16 PM
>>>> *To: *FVC Waterloo Region Discussion
>>>> *Reply To: *FVC Waterloo Region Discussion
>>>> *Subject: *Re: [fvc-wat-disc] Letters to the Editor Needed
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I'll pick the negative one ... just love a scrap ... so here's my
>>>> response
>>>>
>>>> ======================================================
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Dear Editor,
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Re: *The political fallout of breaking a promise* by Joanna
>>>> Smith_Feb3_2017
>>>>
>>>> Ms Smith asks, “But what of the majority of Canadians? Do they care?
>>>> Does it matter?” in reference to Electoral Reform (ER).
>>>>
>>>> It matters. In our system of First Past the Post (FPTP), votes cast for
>>>> a Green candidate, for example, who loses are useless. The Planet-caring,
>>>> environmentally conscious, politically aware voters in the particular
>>>> riding have no say in Ottawa. A certain percentage of all Canadians
>>>> want Green objectives to be part of the laws of Canada.
>>>>
>>>> It matters because these environmentalists should have their say in the
>>>> structure of government. In a proportional system, for instance, every vote
>>>> counts to obtain the same percentage of seats for a party as the party
>>>> received in the national vote count.
>>>>
>>>> It matters because they may not vote in the next election, knowing that
>>>> their votes won’t count.
>>>>
>>>> I matters because, due to discouragement, they may cease to engage in
>>>> the political discussion and the environment will suffer for it.
>>>>
>>>> Later Smith states, “Then there is a much larger group that knows
>>>> little and cares less about ER” in reference to the Canadian electorate at
>>>> large.
>>>>
>>>> “… knows little and cares less … “ is simply cause and effect.
>>>> Unfortunately, it is difficult to excite the electorate about ER
>>>> possibilities when they “know little”. Attempts to educate the public about
>>>> ER are generally regarded as “election activity” which annoys citizens
>>>> between elections. To be fair there is a small percentage which does
>>>> respond with enthusiasm.
>>>>
>>>> New Zealand (NZ) solved the problem by having a trial run at Mixed
>>>> Member PR (MMPR) for four terms. The electorate was educated by experience
>>>> and when consulted after the trial, voted for MMPR over the former FPTP
>>>> system. Their experience demonstrates that an educated public will choose a
>>>> proportional alternative to our antiquated and unfair FPTP which wastes the
>>>> votes of any citizen whose local candidate did not win in their riding.
>>>>
>>>> Germany has practiced MMPR since WW2. The resulting stable form of
>>>> coalition government has allowed Germans to become the master long term
>>>> planners we recognize them for. They avoid the 'Policy Pendulum' in which
>>>> false majority governments cancel, at great expense to the taxpayer, the
>>>> projects of the preceding government. Rather each new government improves
>>>> and supports policies of the previous government.
>>>>
>>>> Yours Truly,
>>>>
>>>> Donald A Fraser,
>>>>
>>>> 184 Forsyth Drive,
>>>>
>>>> Waterloo, Ontario,
>>>>
>>>> N2L-1A2
>>>>
>>>> 519-576-9210 <%28519%29%20576-9210>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 2 February 2017 at 23:02, Sharon Sommerville <
>>>> sharonsommerville at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Hello FairVoting Friends,
>>>>>
>>>>> Two great articles in today's Record for us to respond to:
>>>>>
>>>>> http://www.therecord.com/news-story/7100196-the-political-fa
>>>>> llout-of-breaking-a-promise/
>>>>>
>>>>> http://www.therecord.com/opinion-story/7098054-d-amato-broke
>>>>> n-promise-may-haunt-liberals/
>>>>>
>>>>> We should capitalize on these articles with letters to the editor. A
>>>>> couple of letters in response to each letter would be wonderful.  Any
>>>>> number would be great.
>>>>>
>>>>> Have sent the request out to our larger discussion list as some new
>>>>> names would be helpful!
>>>>>
>>>>> Let me know if you can take either of these on.
>>>>>
>>>>> With thanks,
>>>>> Sharon
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
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>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
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